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  • Jason Cammisa and Haggerty just did us a solid

    The U.S. E36 is the M3 to have, even without a real M engine | Jason Cammisa Revelations | Ep. 20 - YouTube

  • #2
    There's a special place for people that sit on cars.


    MSportParts | Braymond141

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    • #3
      Wow too much to write and respond to in this video.

      The US E36 M3 DOES have a real M engine and is an excellent car. It does NOT have a BMW Motorsport engine and yes there IS a difference between "M" and "Motorsport."

      This part in the description is nonsense:

      "Most importantly, in a drag race between the U.S. and Euro cars in this video (both 3.2-liters), they were dead even to 60 mph — and stayed that way through third gear, leaving Cammisa to conclude that the more reliable U.S. car, especially in sedan form, is the E36 to own."

      You don't know the history of either car and the b32 is very sensitive to any vanos issue.

      I've already posted this in another thread on this forum but you should only look at the official 0-60 mph or 0-100 mph because testing by magazines back then used a 1-foot rollout and test conditions were not consistent to boot. The magazines at the time were in their own battle trying to get the best 0-60 times to help push magazine sales. Take it with a big grain of salt.

      Team PTG (the official race team) only raced the Motorsport engines. They would not have beaten Porsche with the US engines. PTG had a 60%+ win ratio.

      Posting this again for factual reference:

      Here is the breakdown of official times:

      1. M3 S50B30 euro 0-100 km/h = 6.0s (about 5.9s 0-60)
      2. M3 GT 0-100 km/h= 5.9s (about 5.8s 0-60)
      3. M3 LTW = ???
      4. M3 S50B30US 0-60 = 6.1s
      5. M3 S52B32 0-60 = 5.7
      6. M3 S50B32 euro 0-100 km/h = 5.5 (about 5.4s)

      Now some corrections that Camissa talks about with respect to the S50B32:

      They do NOT have main bearing issues. In fact the main bearing are the same bearing used on pretty much all 6 cylinders engines back in the day. They were not different and those engines do not have main bearing issues.

      https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/par...&q=11211706847

      The rod bearings sometimes have issues but that is the case with many high revving engines but the S50B32 is not prone to them so long as you're using the right oil and change it frequently enough.

      If you want to refer to someone experienced building these engines you can watch this video and mosre specifically from 47:18 on regarding main bearings.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_93z82NQZV4

      The U.S. engines are great and very reliable so long as you maintain them. I still have my original S52 with 31K miles sitting in my garage and reluctant to sell it though I do have another S50B32 sitting right next to it.

      Cammisa needs to stop letting the Hagerty folks write some of his script/descriptions and come on this and other forums for more accurate info.

      I could go on and on...
      Last edited by Jim E.; 02-10-2022, 11:23 AM.

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      • #4
        Biting my tongue here haha. But whatever. Nothing wrong with the S52, but it's no S50 replacement.

        Besides, people should need no justification to like their own car.

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        • #5
          I'm just waiting to see every kid's half complete salvage title drift build pop up in the classifieds for $35k.

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          • #6
            Just like Jason predicted....

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            • #7
              I like how they lit the silver car with those M color light bars, that was actually pretty cool for a youtube video.

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              • #8
                All this shit is, is more marketing. A good way to sell some insurance is hype the shit out of one of the most popular enthusiast cars to hundreds of thousands of followers and talk about skyrocketing values, stirring up fear from all of those that love these cars that we need to protect our "investments."
                One more brick in the structure that is just one huge marketing experiment that has become the human existence these days.
                Probably overly deep for a car forum post, but I'm so sick of it. Cars are too expensive to be fun anymore, and all most people are interested in is values, ways to increase value, preserving value, storing cars until they increase in value, etc and it's cause of all these youtube marketing videos disguised as entertainment.

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                • #9
                  Nailed it.

                  Can't blame everyone though. Huge inflation, worst in 40 years here. Savings netting 0% interest.
                  Result is that normal items that wear are becoming assets or investment objects.
                  And with supposedly free money everywhere, problem snowballs Out of control.

                  If you're into watches, you know what's going on in that market.

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                  • #10
                    Well this should bring values back down. Lol

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jim E. View Post
                      Well this should bring values back down. Lol

                      equally entertaining. all the higher ranked m3s are the least reliable ones too or cost the most money to maintain

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Westopher View Post
                        Probably overly deep for a car forum post, but I'm so sick of it. Cars are too expensive to be fun anymore, and all most people are interested in is values, ways to increase value, preserving value, storing cars until they increase in value, etc and it's cause of all these youtube marketing videos disguised as entertainment.
                        I'm conflicted about this. I have firsthand influence (not experience, influence) driving younger/less-moneyed enthusiasts out of a market (Porsche air-cooled) and I gotta say that having a bunch of old, whiney, crotchety, can't-drive bastards putting 7.3 miles per year on a car I specifically built to be driven is incredibly frustrating.

                        But at the same time, reproduction parts have never been easier to buy, and we've never had the choices we do now in the air-cooled market. People are willing to buy expensive parts because the car's value now warrants them and BMW might start production of parts that have been off the market for a while as a result.

                        I'm looking forward to breaking even on my E30 OEM+ build because the prices have risen. I'm not looking forward to selling the car that gave me my posting name, but I know that an 80k-mile E36 M3/4/5 in Boston Green over Modena with a completely overhauled suspension, corrected fifth-gear lean, fresh engine reseal work, and a brand new cooling system will bring good money that I can put toward a higher-mileage coupe that I can build into my dream E36- hopefully with more OEM parts available.

                        YouTube can bite my shiny metal ass, though.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Westopher View Post
                          All this shit is, is more marketing. A good way to sell some insurance is hype the shit out of one of the most popular enthusiast cars to hundreds of thousands of followers and talk about skyrocketing values, stirring up fear from all of those that love these cars that we need to protect our "investments."
                          One more brick in the structure that is just one huge marketing experiment that has become the human existence these days.
                          Probably overly deep for a car forum post, but I'm so sick of it. Cars are too expensive to be fun anymore, and all most people are interested in is values, ways to increase value, preserving value, storing cars until they increase in value, etc and it's cause of all these youtube marketing videos disguised as entertainment.
                          I don't know - seems overly harsh and cynical. Jason is a good presenter, a genuine car guy, and Hagerty is way better insurance company that any other I have worked with. Not saying you are wrong, just sometimes it works. He puts out some of the best car content lately.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Boston Green M3.4.5 View Post

                            I'm conflicted about this. I have firsthand influence (not experience, influence) driving younger/less-moneyed enthusiasts out of a market (Porsche air-cooled) and I gotta say that having a bunch of old, whiney, crotchety, can't-drive bastards putting 7.3 miles per year on a car I specifically built to be driven is incredibly frustrating.

                            But at the same time, reproduction parts have never been easier to buy, and we've never had the choices we do now in the air-cooled market. People are willing to buy expensive parts because the car's value now warrants them and BMW might start production of parts that have been off the market for a while as a result.

                            I'm looking forward to breaking even on my E30 OEM+ build because the prices have risen. I'm not looking forward to selling the car that gave me my posting name, but I know that an 80k-mile E36 M3/4/5 in Boston Green over Modena with a completely overhauled suspension, corrected fifth-gear lean, fresh engine reseal work, and a brand new cooling system will bring good money that I can put toward a higher-mileage coupe that I can build into my dream E36- hopefully with more OEM parts available.

                            YouTube can bite my shiny metal ass, though.
                            I decided long ago that if you want to enjoy it you just need to ignore the "value" discussions or you'll be miserable.

                            I've had to come to grips with this principle more than once, as I had to commute from Dallas to Austin and back for a while (15k miles in 6 months - ouch) and again after I bought an absolutely mint 61k-mile E32 and decided to adopt that as my wife's "new" car. And then again when our cars skyrocketed in value over the last 18 months.

                            You can't let other people determine your happiness.

                            While that's true for many things in life, it's somewhat surprising to find it here.

                            But you can't let the value other people (or the market at large) place on your car determine how, when, or how much you enjoy it (or DON'T enjoy it). Or dictate what you should or shouldn't do with it.

                            My E32 is a good example. When I first got it I felt bad that I didn't want to sell it to someone who would baby it. I felt bad I was driving it to the grocery store, adding dumb miles, looking at my oil reports and seeing the wear from the short trips. I felt bad driving it to Houston and Dallas, adding 400 miles in a single weekend. I could hear the coins clinking, see the value plummeting every time I started it.

                            And I resented this feeling more and more until one day I realized it was no different from any other kind of peer-driven unhappiness since the dawn of middle school. It's my car and I can do what I want with it. I already don't have anti-social media for a reason and this was no different to me.

                            It's no different with Jim E's no-expense-spared build of a car that was already like new, or me putting a 6 speed into a car with 257k miles that almost never makes trips longer than 50 miles anymore.

                            The only question that should matter is whether the price was worth the smile it puts on your face.

                            It doesn't have to have an ROI.

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